llywelyn
	Other than the effect of targeting, what use are Admirals? Can they improve a battle? Do multiple Admirals on a Side affect the battle any? thanks everyone... Llywelyn
Mica Goldstone
	QUOTE Other than the effect of targeting, what use are Admirals? They do not effect targeting. They allow unrestricted use of lists. Being an admiral is simply a level of trust placed on the ship to perform the affiliation's wishes without screwing up. If an affiliation promotes a muppet to admiral, the muppet does not suddenly transform into the tactical genius that was Nelson, the muppet simply has the power of Nelson.
JasTomo
	Come on, its not and Admiral... It’s a flagship. Named flagship because, by its use of flags (In the days of sail) it conveyed its admiral's wishes via system of flags... So, as the ship in this super sci-fi game is given the authority to orchestrate actions in battle, not the captain, could we say that a flagship (Now know as an Admiral) is a designated ship in the fleet with an admiralty encryption/decryption communication centre (Phoenix's version of the enigma machine). Ana the affiliations admirals control the battles via this/these ships from some safe bunker on a starbase somewhere... This way we are not giving inanimate objects rank, just a description of importance... Sorry about bringing this up again but I feel it does need to be addressed, if you want me to drop this subject just tell me to SHUT UP!!! You have changed the label of colonies to starbase though, so change in this game is accepted well, especially when its for the better… ;-)
Steve-Law
	Yeah I agree with him. ^^ Name the ranks for what they are, Ship ranks, not people ranks.
kerryh
	We the various affiliations could change the ranks to something for ships rather then people, say: 0 - Ship 1 - Patrol Ship 2 - Warship 3 - Wing Command 4 - Squadron Command 5 - Fleet Command
Steve-Law
	True, but it could confuse a lot of people, if the default ranks are still related to personel.
JasTomo
	QUOTE 0 - Ship 1 - Patrol Ship 2 - Warship 3 - Wing Command 4 - Squadron Command 5 - Fleet Command This starts ok but leads into rank again... i.e.: Wing Command Squadron Command Fleet Command These imply that a lump of metal has command... How about: Ship of the line Capital ship Flag ship As a flag ship in any navy is the most important
Duckworth-Lewis
	QUOTE (JasTomo @ Jul 11 2003, 09:58 AM) These imply that a lump of metal has command... How about: Ship of the line Capital ship Flag ship As a flag ship in any navy is the most important I suspect that thats part of the problem with designating rank to ships as opposed to the captain. Other than flagship there are not many satisfactory names that signify the seniority of a vessel For me 'Capital ship' is a bit of a catch all term used to represent a large warship and 'SOL' is a name equivalent to 'Destroyer', and 'Frigate'...whilst patrol ship and warship are more related to the ships role. Guess you could use terms like lead ship or perhaps primary/secondary/tertiary - but these kind of lack flavour.
JasTomo
	QUOTE Guess you could use terms like lead ship or perhaps primary/secondary/tertiary - but these kind of lack flavour. Or why not: Primary Flagship Secondary Controler Tertiary Controler etc... Anything except the names of ranks for people....
kerryh
	QUOTE (JasTomo @ Jul 11 2003, 09:58 AM) This starts ok but leads into rank again... i.e.: Wing Command Squadron Command Fleet Command As a flag ship in any navy is the most important No it doesn't. If it was a 'people' rank it would Wing Commander, Squadron Commander, Fleet Commander. The word Command (as in Command Post) signfies that the ship is the site of the Wing Commander's Command Post. A flag ship in any navy is not the most important. The most important ship in a navy as a whole is whatever the politicians and/or people of the nation decide it is - this usually has little bearing to where an flag officer may or may not keep his flag. The most important ship in a naval unit (i.e. a fleet or squadron or whatever) is whatever ship is required to survive the longest to carry out the unit's objective, in the case of a modern US Navy Carrier Battle Group this is the Carrier which is turns out is usually where the ranking flag officer resides but not always (I have personally witnessed a flag officer place his flag on a Aegis class cruiser rather then on the carrier in such a battle group before).
JasTomo
	"A flag ship in any navy is not the most important" WHAT... have you beed drinking? What is it then? The flag ship of any national navy or merchant fleet IS their most important ship... A carrier group or flatila of ship will also have a nominated flag ship which will hold the fleet/fatila/group commander... The name flag ship comes from the fact that this ship would use a series of flags to relay commands from the fleet commander to the rest of its group (Fleet/Flatila/Etc)... In the Falklands campain the Royal Navy used Invincible as the task force flagship... This is where Admiral Woodward held his briefings and issued his fleet orders from... Ok, no flags are used now, but the ships authentication signiture was used to substantiate the orders... Come on... The Flag ship is not the most important!!! Then what is...?
JasTomo
	I know what you are saying, the biggest most expensive ship isn't always the flagship... This is not what I'm saying... but the flag officer (Or the person giving the orders to the other ships) is on the flag ship... If the officer is still able to give commande he could be on a row boat... If he is still able to give commands to the fleet, this is his FLAG SHIP (or boat LOL). Ok a bit extreme, but we have established that Pheonix will not support officers as having the rank to order ships in battle... but the ships.. The original discsion was that the name of a persons rank doesn't sound good when given to an inanimate ship... And that a change of name for the ship rank structure would eliminate this little gripe (and it is only a petty gripe realy as it doesn't effect the game play). Anyway, who's to say that Pheonix officers are not controling the fleet movements from some starbase inside some safe system... and transmitting orders from a central control station to a nominated FLAG SHIP in the disputed area of space... Ahh this subject is boring me now and its almost time to go home from work so I'm feeling happy again ;-)
Mawet Manchu
	I do agree that the names of SHIPS ranks, should not be the same as ranks associated with personell. This game is very confusing to begin with anyway, and this is just one of those things that could be changed with (at an utter guess, and Im probably wrong) relative ease. Just change the names of the ranks to fit in with the idea that they are inanimate objects. Kieron