kerryh
	Are Black Markets of some kind going to be added back into the game? It kinda sucks with the drug demand being clearly visible to anyone with a starbase on the world.
Ro'a-lith
	Perhaps black markets could be set up in some fashion to undermine the obvious, colony-printed demand quota, and at the same time provide a greater value of stellars for the illegal items?
David Bethel
	There are no plans (at this point) for black markets. Its unlikely that any position except a starbase will be able to gain stellars from a planet - as its an underpinning part of the game. A starbase is much less of an official government positon (as with BSE) and therefore showing the drug prices its just more of a feeling derived from the local population.
kerryh
	QUOTE (David Bethel @ Jun 11 2003, 08:33 AM) There are no plans (at this point) for black markets. Its unlikely that any position except a starbase will be able to gain stellars from a planet - as its an underpinning part of the game. A starbase is much less of an official government positon (as with BSE) and therefore showing the drug prices its just more of a feeling derived from the local population. I don't have a problem with only a starbase being able to derive stellars for a planet, what I have a problem with is there isn't any way at present to replicate something resembling the black markets of old or for that matter just trading in dodgy items to the world's popluation. When you do a Special Action to generate a drug demand on a world, everyone with a starbase (or with a position capable of performing a Scan Planetary Economy) instantly (well as soon as they get their update) knows about it. Kerry
Doc_mark
	**There are no plans (at this point) for black markets. Its unlikely that any position except a starbase will be able to gain stellars from a planet - as its an underpinning part of the game. A starbase is much less of an official government positon (as with BSE) and therefore showing the drug prices its just more of a feeling derived from the local population. ** Okay. I do have a problem with this, but as I can see it being something only FET, RIP and IND would do I"m willing to wait. Personally I'm VERY EAGER for Black Markets and opportunities to gain stellars from a planet by NOT using a starbase. For the future I think there should be the possibility for a set order to sell direct to the planet from starships or ground parties. There may be less scope, but there is a definate market for the selling of drugs and contraband items to worlds which are colonised by affiliations who do not use drugs, contraband etc. It is a legitimate illegal way to make money and should be put in as soon as God(Mica) and Demi-God(Dave) get a chance. Doc
Ro'a-lith
	Perhaps have black markets as another sort of operative? Except the effect they have is to channel a percentage of the starbases' own sales through to the creating position/political... effectively, the BM 'steals' a percentage of the starbases' weekly sales and sells them on to the population. Would open up a lot of scope for political schnanigans.
Doc_mark
	QUOTE (Ro'a-lith @ Jun 15 2003, 02:13 AM) Perhaps have black markets as another sort of operative?  Except the effect they have is to channel a percentage of the starbases' own sales through to the creating position/political...   Interesting. Having the Black Market as a seperate printout would be a good idea. Have the operative at the colony set up a Black Market by SA. Ships in orbit could be given a Deliver or Sell to Black Market order. Interaction with the Black Market would only be accepted by those with the BM's security Code. As with the old Black Markets an amount of troops/ equipment could be put into the Black Market for defence. However if/when the BM is discovered it should be attacked by Ground Party issuing a special action rather than the entire colony attacking it. 50,000 troops pouring into the warehouse district... yeah right Doc
Lord Scrimm
	I like the idea of having Black Markets be an Operative ability - perhaps another "Sabotage" Mission. The maximum percentage that could be "siphoned" off the top of the Starbase's merchandising would be about 1/2 of the Operatives Sabotage rating - with the mission penalty based upon how much the Operative sells to the market, which is based upon it's "Risks Taken" percentage (comparable to the "Alter Production" incremental increases for percentage change...) Have a "percentage returned to selling position" Standing order on the Operative (or require that the "Operate Black Market" Order has to be a Standing Order with a % applied to it) that enables it to profit, yet still automate ships sending it cargo and selling the dubious wares: ie: Operative A has a 40% Sabotage Rating and is located in GTT HQ <G> It could siphon a maximum of 20% of GTT HQ's Merchandising capability - but as it has it's "Risks Taken" at 25%, then only 5% of GTT HQ's capacity could be used for this Black Market (still pretty sizable!) The operative has a "% Returned to Seller" Standing order of 80% and a passing RIP ship, with authorization to "Deliver" to the Operative, delivers some illicit trade goods to be sold to the populace. An operative missions is generated and as long as it did not exceed the 5% capacity of the Black Market, then the goods would be sold to the populace (barring being located by starbase security), the RIP would get 80% of the take, and the Operative skims 20% off the top for his trouble. Meanwhile, GTT HQ's Merchandising capacity is reduced by this amount - just as if it had sold to the population itself. If the amount exceeded the 5% capacity, then only that amount would be sold, but the remainder would be "stored" for future use and would increase the Skill Mission Penalty of the Operative by an amount based upon how much was being stored (It's hard to hide 1000 Pleasure Slaves... <G>) I don't see the need for sending troops or weapons to support the activities of the Black Market - they would only make the profile of the operation higher and increase the risks associated with the Market. I envision the Black Market as having the Operative know who to get in contact with that will buy the illicit goods and then pass them on to the ultimate end-user. Just a few of my thoughts on the idea - I'm all for it <EG> Cheers, Rich Fanning aka Lord Lawrence Scrimm CIA Director of Regional Operations
David Bethel
	There is a possible option for black markets, addressing in the issue of selling drugs. Basically the sales of items on the black market would only be allowed on planets with starbases. This would reduce the merch effect of the starbase's and would be limited by the merch capacity of the starbases. This would effectively leach money from the starbase. Iit would have to be limited and possible to crack down on etc. This would hold with the basic idea that money can only be generated by starbases whihc will not change. Agents/ operatives are a possible route for this.