>Date 10.4: Build Complexes {1021} {1}
You built 1 Cave Complex (1021).
Raw materials: 2 Structural Modules (420), 23 Rock Structural Modules (430)
Week 11 - Same place, and with a surplus of Structurals, Caves Require:
>Date 11.4: Build Complexes {1021} {1}
You built 1 Cave Complex (1021).
Raw materials: 25 Rock Structural Modules (430)
Would have been nice to know about the change a little in advance so that stockpiles could be maintained and shortages accounted for.
Rich Fanning
aka
Lord Lawrence Scrimm
CIA Intelligence Director
There was a rather spurious bug which meant that if two items were required, one of which could substitute for the other, it allowed one to become negative. As this was the only item where it occurred, it seemed better to change caves than spend an annoying long amount of time sorting it so that it calculated it correctly.
| QUOTE (Mica Goldstone @ Mar 25 2004, 07:53 AM) |
| We thought that nobody would notice There was a rather spurious bug which meant that if two items were required, one of which could substitute for the other, it allowed one to become negative. As this was the only item where it occurred, it seemed better to change caves than spend an annoying long amount of time sorting it so that it calculated it correctly. |
No it means I have to change over 3 starbases to stop delivering 2 SM and 23 RSM to outposts and now collect all the SM back for them the outposts.
However, I do prefer this change as it means that a starbase does not have to build SM in order to build caves. Always a pain when you run out of SM!
Although it will mean more shipping to setup hidden outposts in Imperial space <sigh> Andy goes back to reconfiguring ships.
Andy
| QUOTE (Andy @ Mar 25 2004, 11:21 AM) |
| No it means I have to change over 3 starbases to stop delivering 2 SM and 23 RSM to outposts and now collect all the SM back for them the outposts. |
Even the ones where you have negative structural module stockpiles?
As for the reasoning behind the change... there are a lot of things on the programming and support side of the game that impress the hell out of me. Not being able to create cave complexes without potentially incurring a negative stockpile of one of the components, takes it back the other way...
TonyH
| QUOTE (ABBA @ Mar 26 2004, 08:12 AM) |
| It's a bit inconvenient that after this change, no individual ship in my entire fleet can carry sufficient rock structural modules for a single cave complex. How about allowing substitution the other way, i.e. for caves up to 75 SM's instead? |
You can make caves directly out of structural modules, that was never the problem. The problem occurred when you had enough structural modules, but insufficient RSM's. This then checked for SM's, found them and used them, but at the same time they were already being used as part of the process anyway. In some cases where there were a lot of caves built at once, this meant that it produced a negative SM stockpile. By removing SM's from the building requirements it will not pose this problem. Yes you can use 75 SM's to build a cave.
| QUOTE |
| You can make caves directly out of structural modules, that was never the problem |
It was a problem - the only way I knew caves required rock structural modules in the first place was for my first outpost: Turning up with 25 SM's I got the result: Error - Insufficent Rock Structural Module (430) to create outpost complex
I had to use the SMS website to discover the real requirements for caves. If, all along, I could have used SM's instead could you point me to where in the rules it says that, and how many (because I could use the info right now).
TonyH
100 structurals present at an outpost:
>Date 14.1: Build Complexes {1021} {1}
Error - Failed to produce any complexes.
Short of materials: 25 Rock Structural Modules (430)
Is this a bug?
TonyH
The recent modification was that cave complexes now require 25 rock structural modules. I assume Mica's mistake was to assume that the substitution worked the other way. I was doubtful about this to start with, and have shown that it doesn't work: 3 structural modules cannot substitute for one rock structural module, and therefore you cannot create a cave complex from 75 structural modules - unless it's a bug and the substitution IS meant to work the other way too.
So, my originial point stands: 25 rock structural units come to 12500 MU's - too big for any single ship in my possession to carry. It then becomes very difficult to create secret bases in one go.
Rather than change the requirement again, or re-write the substutions rules, how about just dropping the mass of a Rock structural to 480 MU's? or even just 400? They're too big to cart around at the moment as it is. If they really are just for manufacture for use on-site, it might as well be 1,000 MU's. But if they are meant to be transportable, one shipload should be useful in itself.
Or possibly I should be researching 'Rock structural Modules MkII'?
TonyH
| QUOTE (ABBA @ Apr 9 2004, 07:57 PM) |
| Rather than change the requirement again, or re-write the substutions rules, how about just dropping the mass of a Rock structural to 480 MU's? or even just 400? They're too big to cart around at the moment as it is. If they really are just for manufacture for use on-site, it might as well be 1,000 MU's. But if they are meant to be transportable, one shipload should be useful in itself. Or possibly I should be researching 'Rock structural Modules MkII'? TonyH |
There's more complex types possible to use to create a stealthy single-complex base than caves. Maybe not quite as good but look at the various complex TM's.... You can then (if you choose) deliver RSM's to the new outpost using two ships
I would say to leave RSM's as they are. After all, the TM starts "Structural modules fashioned from natural rock strata are heavy. As such they are unsuitable for transportation."
Dan
Gareth SMS Vice-PD