gordon
| Turn Cost £2.3 - 60p Update charge

is this a mistake?

A charge for the special action + then a charge to get the result of the special action???

It is an outpost.

Gord
Ro'a-lith
Special actions are £1.70. Add 60p for the update printout = £2.30, I guess - I think the 60p update charge is applied regardless. I've certainly been charged it for running a 'free' special action at an outpost before (Built the blasted thing in the wrong place...).
Archangel
QUOTE
| Turn Cost £2.3 - 60p Update charge


And I got

QUOTE
| Turn Cost £0.6 - 60p Update charge


Clearly this is more just a matter of an incomplete analysis of elemental charges making up the total, coupled with a comment related to one of the charges.

It is also clear the "£0.6" portion could also be formatted properly, something like "£0.60", hopefully including in a multiple line case, the columns also line up.


Archangel
David Bethel
QUOTE
It is also clear the "£0.6" portion could also be formatted properly, something like "£0.60", hopefully including in a multiple line case, the columns also line up.


If it was only so simple smile.gif Currently if the output routine sees a badly formated float (0.01000) and converts it to something nicer (0.01) and so it sees 2.30 and converts it to 2.3. I would have to rewrite the whole output routine to get this case through.... now the output routine is used by everything and is 3-4years old (hence crap - but works) and so i can almost guarentee that something else somewhere would go wrong as a result.

So yes its wrongly formated but there is a reason (blame dan - he made me do it)

QUOTE
incomplete analyisis of elemental charges

No it just tells you about the update, there was no intension to tell you anything else - i counts down the free updates if you have them.

QUOTE
is this a mistake?

Updates cost £0.6 unless you have upgraded politicals, only gps and starship are free.

Steve-Law
I think the question was why was he charged for the update when he was already charged for the Special Action.

Essentially there are 2 (or more) tiers of Special Actions costs - £1.70 for ships and starbases, but £2.30 for Outposts (and platforms). God alone knows (well okay, God, Mica and David wink.gif ) what it would cost for a political Special Action...

Wasn't there some discussion at one point about a reduced output that would show the results of turns/special actions without actually giving a full outpost printout?

(Although thinking about it this could also be abused with scanning from platforms/outposts for "free". Maybe Special Action results only (no other information) could be returned for free?)
David Bethel
QUOTE
I think the question was why was he charged for the update when he was already charged for the Special Action


Yup and the answer is that updates cost. Its not a mistake and its done because special actions could (and would) be used to get updates for free.

Special actions can be done from GPs and Ships for no added cost and so it does not detriment anyone.

I know it sounds harsh but basically if there is a possible exploit in the game its approached with the 'would i do it'. Well i would have a big list of ops that needed an update and every time i needed a special done that was not linked to a distant location i'd use one of the outposts.
gtdoug
What about Starbases???

Do we pay for issuing 'request update' order...?

GTDoug.
FLZPD
QUOTE (David Bethel @ Feb 3 2005, 02:40 PM)
QUOTE
I think the question was why was he charged for the update when he was already charged for the Special Action


Yup and the answer is that updates cost. Its not a mistake and its done because special actions could (and would) be used to get updates for free.

Special actions can be done from GPs and Ships for no added cost and so it does not detriment anyone.

I know it sounds harsh but basically if there is a possible exploit in the game its approached with the 'would i do it'. Well i would have a big list of ops that needed an update and every time i needed a special done that was not linked to a distant location i'd use one of the outposts.

I understand the reasoning, but Special Actions done at starbases and from your Political position do not incur an update cost. I can see no logical reason why the paying positions are treated differently.

Cant you get a very cut-down outpost print back? ie. besides the SA results, it says nothing more (which is less than you see for free on your political report/online order editor)??


I do SAs from an outpost sometimes, because of where they are. I have found out, though, that you can do the SA from your political "on behalf of" the outpost - you get the same results, but cheaper, so I would suggest using this method to anyone in the same boat

Mark
David Bethel
QUOTE
What about Starbases???

Do we pay for issuing 'request update' order...?


No - paided updates have only ever applied to outposts and platforms. Starbase/political costs are fixed.

QUOTE
I do SAs from an outpost sometimes, because of where they are. I have found out, though, that you can do the SA from your political "on behalf of" the outpost - you get the same results, but cheaper, so I would suggest using this method to anyone in the same boat


Indeed
Paul
It does seem a little harsh to be hit for the update fee considering you just paid £1.70.

I can't see how this can be viewed as an exploit ... why would you use a more expensive option just to get an update?

Seems a little cheeky to me tongue.gif

Doesn't affect me as I have the £4 political.
just my opinion ... probably wrong biggrin.gif
Steve-Law
QUOTE (Paul @ Feb 5 2005, 03:06 PM)
I can't see how this can be viewed as an exploit ... why would you use a more expensive option just to get an update?

What David means is that if you were planning to do an SA *anyway* and it could be done at an outpost, it's a way to do the SA *and* get a free update at the same time as a by-product.

I say go for a free return of the SA result with no position data included.
Duckworth-Lewis
QUOTE (Paul @ Feb 5 2005, 03:06 PM)
It does seem a little harsh to be hit for the update fee considering you just paid £1.70.

I can't see how this can be viewed as an exploit ... why would you use a more expensive option just to get an update?

Seems a little cheeky to me tongue.gif

Doesn't affect me as I have the £4 political.
just my opinion ... probably wrong biggrin.gif

I think the point is that if you are making a special action that does not need to be made from a specific location, then a player may decide to use a platform/OP so that they would get the update on the position as a bonus.

It's harsh if you need to make an SA that is specific to the position, but if the SA could have been made at by any other position then KJC technically lose the 60p for the update.
Andy
This was implemented at the begining of the game as players latched onto the idea you could get a free update. We should have to pay for the updates as well as the SA.

The alternative would be to receive just the SA results and no outpost update

Andy
gordon
Sometimes it is necessary to do the SA in an outpost. Personally I couldnt care less about the update as long as can see the sa results. If this can be done by doing the SA on my political it is fine with me.

I just wondered if it was a bug. We were discussing it on IRC and some people thought it was and some didnt. Why discuss it when you can get the answer right away from KJC.

Gord
Archangel
QUOTE
Updates cost £0.6 unless you have upgraded politicals, only gps and starship are free.


What is an 'upgraded political'? Is this a reference to the £3/£4 options that are available or do you mean something else?
David Bethel
QUOTE
Is this a reference to the £3/£4 options that are available or do you mean something else?

yes
Steve-Law
QUOTE (David Bethel @ Feb 9 2005, 11:01 AM)
QUOTE
Is this a reference to the £3/£4 options that are available or do you mean something else?

yes

And no, respectively wink.gif
Paul
QUOTE (Duckworth-Lewis @ Feb 7 2005, 02:20 PM)
I think the point is that if you are making a special action that does not need to be made from a specific location, then a player may decide to use a platform/OP so that they would get the update on the position as a bonus.



I see what you mean now!
wow ... people really do that?

I agree the best would just to be to send the SA result and no outpost details unless they request update then normal pricing would apply.
Archangel
Well, the yes and no cleared things up very nicely indeed.

Thank goodness they were in order.

Thanks to you both.

biggrin.gif
Archangel
QUOTE
yes


David has clearly spent too much time optimizing code and memory consumption.

wink.gif
Andy
He means the £3 / £4 version not the bionic man version